No more STV... forever?

[Feral]

So STV is voted down, this time with larger numbers. Counts are still coming in, but so far it looks like

~61% FPTP
~39% STV

Still a few hundred ballot boxes to come in, but it's a pretty decisive defeat in my eyes compared to the 58% it got last time around.

Elections BC results here

[chupacabra]

I thought it was going to be close too. I guess once it was actually a choice to make it a reality people got nervous about the change. Anyway, I find it disappointing but obviously most do not agree.

[sprinter]

I knew it was a goner when I guy I work with who has a master degree could not understand how it works.

[jbazett]

Thank God it's gone! Hopefully they'll come up with a viable alternative next time around instead of beating the STV horse again.

[gerewh0re]

very happy it failed, but sadly jbazett, we will see no reform in the next 20 years at the very least

what a brutal way to get "reform"

[SammyJ]

Gonna have to campaign for change from the inside. I say we form a nsmb party and run candidates in all the areas with decent mtb'ing. We will run based on a simple platform, follow the Obama model, then get elected. Once elected, we will dismantle the voting system and implement pro-mtb legislation. I nominate LeeLau for leader.

[kalisto]

Disappointing indeed. Sad to see numbers so low... Too bad most people had no desire to learn about it/voting against it because they didn't understand.



Edit:

If we had a more proportional system, results would be as followed:

Liberals: 46.02% 39 seats
NDP: 42.06% 36 seats
Green: 8.10% 7 seats
Other: 3.83% 3 seats


Actual Results:

Liberals: 46.02% 49 seats
NDP: 42.06% 36 seats
Green: 8.10% 0 seats
Other: 3.83% 0 seats


Plurality Voting +1

[jbazett]

Originally Posted by kalisto

Disappointing indeed. Sad to see numbers so low... Too bad most people had no desire to learn about it/voting against it because they didn't understand.

You'd need a PHD to learn all of the ins and outs of STV, you should give people a little more credit though, it was voted down because it's a retarded system. There are plenty of other proportional representation models out there, let's hope they pick a better one next time.

[chupacabra]

Originally Posted by jbazett

You'd need a PHD to learn all of the ins and outs of STV, you should give people a little more credit though, it was voted down because it's a retarded system. There are plenty of other proportional representation models out there, let's hope they pick a better one next time.

It was voted down because people fear change, but arguing what would happen with the system is all academic at this point anyway. Let's hope that "next time" occurs within our lifetime.

[gerewh0re]

Originally Posted by kalisto

Disappointing indeed. Sad to see numbers so low... Too bad most people had no desire to learn about it

funny, being on the "no" side, i thought it was too bad that most the people voting for it were not willing to learn about it and were just voting for "change" as in any change will do

[jbazett]

Originally Posted by chupacabra

It was voted down because people fear change, but arguing what would happen with the system is all academic at this point anyway. Let's hope that "next time" occurs within our lifetime.

It wasn't a referendum on electoral reform. It was a referendum on a particular brand of proportional representation. Don't get the two things confused. If there had been a check box that said "Would you like electoral reform?" I can guarantee that it would pass. But it wasn't, it was asking whether or not we would like to adopt a fairly unpopular form of proportional representation. People don't fear change, thats just what people say when they don't get their way politically. And "Next time" will occur far sooner now, than if we had adopted this backwoods system.

[kalisto]

Originally Posted by gerewh0re

funny, being on the "no" side, i thought it was too bad that most the people voting for it were not willing to learn about it and were just voting for "change" as in any change will do

I think there's a difference of knowing about it, and knowing all the ins/outs of it.

I do expect people to generally know how it works. I don't expect people to know EXACTLY how it works.


... that said, it's politics, when don't we vote for the lesser of two evils?

Originally Posted by jbazett

You'd need a PHD to learn all of the ins and outs of STV, you should give people a little more credit though, it was voted down because it's a retarded system. There are plenty of other proportional representation models out there, let's hope they pick a better one next time.

Any one in particular we should look at?

[chupacabra]

Originally Posted by jbazett

It wasn't a referendum on electoral reform. It was a referendum on a particular brand of proportional representation. Don't get the two things confused. If there had been a check box that said "Would you like electoral reform?" I can guarantee that it would pass. But it wasn't, it was asking whether or not we would like to adopt a fairly unpopular form of proportional representation. People don't fear change, thats just what people say when they don't get their way politically. And "Next time" will occur far sooner than if we had adopted this backwoods system.

I am not going to get back into the arguments for and against STV, but if you think people do not fear the unknown then I have given you too much credit. I am not going to hold my breath for next time.

[kalisto]

I have a genius idea...

Why don't we pick a bunch of random people from BC that more or less represents the general public. Give them a couple of months, with presentations from every different electoral system, then give them time to pick the best system? After that do that, we'll have a big vote on it?

[jbazett]

Originally Posted by kalisto

Any one in particular we should look at?

I'm a personal fan of New Zealand's dual vote system, with a single vote for regional representation and a "Party" vote to decide who forms the house. The German system is obviously the cadillac of proportional representation, although it doesn't leave room for independents. Both are comparitively simple systems that don't do away with local representation and don't reduce accountability like STV does.