"i'm the guy that didn't quote Obama"

[Mr. Charles]

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...oryId=88988093

there a link there in blue to listen to this reporter's recall of a speech against the war by obama in 2002. kind of interesting.

[Adam West]

Originally Posted by Biking Fiend

This message is hidden because Mr. Charles is on your ignore list.

and i care why

[Geologyboy]

I have to agree with the commentary there that this was not a particularly difficult speech for Obama to make. Standing up in a blue state and opposing president Bush isn't what i would call 'risky'.

Meanwhile, how does Clinton make that speech? One year after 9/11 and a New York Senator, that would have been 'risky' if not career ending.

[Mic]

I read the article and call me naive but I think it shows a kind of honesty which differs from most today's politicians in so far as that most do not seem to be that honest when it comes to once-made statements.

Oh, and a guy who has such legs as his avatar cannot be on anybody's ignore list...

[Mr. Charles]

Originally Posted by Geologyboy

I have to agree with the commentary there that this was not a particularly difficult speech for Obama to make. Standing up in a blue state and opposing president Bush isn't what i would call 'risky'.

Meanwhile, how does Clinton make that speech? One year after 9/11 and a New York Senator, that would have been 'risky' if not career ending.

I can't wait to see him battle McCain.

[gearwh0re]

Originally Posted by Geologyboy

I have to agree with the commentary there that this was not a particularly difficult speech for Obama to make. Standing up in a blue state and opposing president Bush isn't what i would call 'risky'.

Meanwhile, how does Clinton make that speech? One year after 9/11 and a New York Senator, that would have been 'risky' if not career ending.

sounds like someone who doesn't undertstand the american media or politics

in 2002 , calling that or any war "dumb" was considered borderline treason by about 70% of the country

remember cnn, showing all the protests (begrudgingly) and the reporter/anchor would also say the same thing "now we must remind you , near as we can tell these people are protesting the war and not protesting america itself , and we have no way to tell if they are treasonous/canadian/hippies" it was GREAT

[Mr. Charles]

Originally Posted by gearwh0re

sounds like someone who doesn't undertstand the american media or politics

in 2002 , calling that or any war "dumb" was considered borderline treason by about 70% of the country

remember cnn, showing all the protests (begrudgingly) and the reporter/anchor would also say the same thing "now we must remind you , near as we can tell these people are protesting the war and not protesting america itself , and we have no way to tell if they are treasonous/canadian/hippies" it was GREAT

well just to point out one inaccuracy here. You are conceptually correct about everything in this post... it is risky. BUt i want address one peripheral issue that i don't think Canadians or anyone else in the world really gets about the US...

it's not 70% of the COUNTRY... it's 70% of the political country. That is a major difference that you need to be american to truly understand. The academics and educated people in the US are unfortunaly not politically involved or savy. Why are we that way? Because it NEVER goes our way. It too bad, but our representatives - the democrats - are weak compared to the inflammatory and coporate republicans. We don't have tools like Fox news, war and CNN. We have Comedy Central, printed word and cars that run on veggie oil, and in the USA those things don't win elections. We have people like John kerry as politicians-- horrible politicians-- going up against people like the Bush family who will use anything they can to win votes.

i just want to make the distnction between the the US and the Political US. It's unfortunate. ANyway Obama is one of the first in a long time that is making us feel like we have a chance.

I know this post won't convince you that it is UNTRUE that 70% of america is fat, religious, and unaware of the rest of the world... but it might at least convince you that it's possible.

[Poz]

Originally Posted by Mr. Charles

well just to point out one inaccuracy here. You are conceptually correct about everything in this post... it is risky. BUt i want address one peripheral issue that i don't think Canadians or anyone else in the world really gets about the US...

it's not 70% of the COUNTRY... it's 70% of the political country. That is a major difference that you need to be american to truly understand. The academics and educated people in the US are unfortunaly not politically involved or savy. Why are we that way? Because it NEVER goes our way. It too bad, but our representatives - the democrats - are weak compared to the inflammatory and coporate republicans. We don't have tools like Fox news, war and CNN. We have Comedy Central, printed word and cars that run on veggie oil, and in the USA those things don't win elections. We have people like John kerry as politicians-- horrible politicians-- going up against people like the Bush family who will use anything they can to win votes.

i just want to make the distnction between the the US and the Political US. It's unfortunate. ANyway Obama is one of the first in a long time that is making us feel like we have a chance.

I know this post won't convince you that it is UNTRUE that 70% of america is fat, religious, and unaware of the rest of the world... but it might at least convince you that it's possible.

Well said, very true from my perspective when I'm travelling in the US.

I really hope Obama wins, having someone like that leading the country will be inspiring and potentially rally a large portion of the country together. He'll also likely get more international support for the US.

In the end for the President, tonnes of experience and age doesn't really matter-- that is why you surround yourself with good advisors and cheifs of staff. The President needs to be the voice to the people and make people feel they have hope and that things are good and getting better.

[gearwh0re]

Originally Posted by Mr. Charles

I know this post won't convince you that it is UNTRUE that 70% of america is fat, religious, and unaware of the rest of the world... but it might at least convince you that it's possible.

no need to convince. i know this, you are correct and i should have been more clear.

when speaking of political issues, in my mind, the voting public is all that matters in that they make the decisions.

[gearwh0re]

Originally Posted by Geologyboy

Meanwhile, how does Clinton make that speech? One year after 9/11 and a New York Senator, that would have been 'risky' if not career ending.

how does she NOT make that speech?

she wants to be the leader of the free world and is scared to say "hey, i am a new yorker, i want justice as much as the next guy, but this is not justice. iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. saddam is a horrible man and an enemy of the US but is currently controlable and we know he has no WMD so let's focus on bringing those bastards that killed 3000 americans to justice"

[Adam West]

anybody watch the fifth estate the other day "the lies that led to the iraq war"?

no i dont have a link

[gearwh0re]

Originally Posted by Adam West

anybody watch the fifth estate the other day "the lies that led to the iraq war"?

no i dont have a link

your contributions to this thread WILL NOT be forgotten, young man!

[Adam West]

Originally Posted by gearwh0re

your contributions to this thread WILL NOT be forgotten, young man!

mission accomplished!

http://www.cbc.ca/fifth/lies/

its really long so i doubt anyone will care enough to actually watch its

coles notes from what i remeber is they explained how they went from bin laden to iraq... and now they want to go for iran..

[Mr. Charles]

i'll watch it later. always looking for a good diversion.

[damian]

Originally Posted by Mr. Charles

well just to point out one inaccuracy here. You are conceptually correct about everything in this post... it is risky. BUt i want address one peripheral issue that i don't think Canadians or anyone else in the world really gets about the US...

it's not 70% of the COUNTRY... it's 70% of the political country. That is a major difference that you need to be american to truly understand. The academics and educated people in the US are unfortunaly not politically involved or savy. Why are we that way? Because it NEVER goes our way. It too bad, but our representatives - the democrats - are weak compared to the inflammatory and coporate republicans. We don't have tools like Fox news, war and CNN. We have Comedy Central, printed word and cars that run on veggie oil, and in the USA those things don't win elections. We have people like John kerry as politicians-- horrible politicians-- going up against people like the Bush family who will use anything they can to win votes.

i just want to make the distnction between the the US and the Political US. It's unfortunate. ANyway Obama is one of the first in a long time that is making us feel like we have a chance.

I know this post won't convince you that it is UNTRUE that 70% of america is fat, religious, and unaware of the rest of the world... but it might at least convince you that it's possible.

Except that;

-Your country was built on conservative (libertarian) values.
- CNN liberal bias is nearly as strong as FOXs' Republican bias
-Neo-Cons have the Bush family, Liberals have the Clintons.

Plus truth be told, Barry wont do anything significant. If anything he's going to continue on the liberal path towards socialism.