Apple vs Samsung?

[Sethimus]

Originally Posted by KenN

If apple keeps this up, Samsung (and others) will damn well innovate the hell out of apple and they'll be left behind.


Kn.

nope, they would just copy work of several years in a few months...

when was the last time some other company than apple redefined a consumer electronic product and reshaped a market?

apple:

music players
how to sell music in the digital age
phones
ultrabooks
tablets

samsung:

none

[switch]

Originally Posted by biggles604

All I can make out from the whole thing (which is really quite complex) is that Apple are a bunch of douchey bullies trying to maneuver into a position for a monopoly.

This.

Originally Posted by jpi

That's what I am looking for, thanks

Apple hasn't gone after the S3, but very likely will.


In the early 90s, Apple sued Microsoft on 187 counts of patent/copyright infringement - they wanted Windows to die as it was a huge threat to their Mac OS. The suit went on for quite a while, but in the end Apple lost on every count. Within a very short period of time, Apple was ready to file for Chapter 11, and low and behold Microsoft bailed them out to a tune of $250 million. So, for almost 20 years, Apple hasn't gone after MS, or vice-versa.

Apple literally steals ideas, puts them into production, then claims ownership. A lot of their patents are crap. Rounded corners on icons?

Samsung is an incredibly serious threat to the iPhone and iPad; Apple is seeing their cash cow being taken to the butcher. When you can buy a similar device for half the price, the more expensive product is going to drop down to a market share in the single digits (like MacOS did versus Windows).

What will be interesting is what Google will do now that they have the Motorola patents. Hopefully they'll be some deal made, such as with Apple and Microsoft, where no more litigation and stifling is occuring.

Just think if the automotive industry behaved like Apple. BMW and Mercedes would be suing the pants off of most other manufacturers for copying their body designs.

[go-t]

It's not like patent law disputes are new, Nokia won a settlement against Apple that could probably keep their company afloat.
Article

Electronics manufacturers, especially mobile device makers, license patented technologies from each other all the time, for a fee. For instance, after a patent "misunderstanding” last year, Apple started paying Nokia an estimated $11.50 for every iPhone sold. Similarly, in a settlement agreement last year, Samsung agreed to pay Microsoft $10 to $15 for each smartphone or tablet it sells.

Bottom line: Apple had patents, under US law it was determined that Samsung infringed on those patents. Samsung was ordered to pay reparations; will likely appeal. Whether or not the LAW is right or wrong is for lawyers to determine through the legal process.

[KenN]

Originally Posted by Sethimus

nope, they would just copy work of several years in a few months...

when was the last time some other company than apple redefined a consumer electronic product and reshaped a market?

apple:

music players
how to sell music in the digital age
phones
ultrabooks
tablets

samsung:

none

Every single point above is debatable, including whether apple actually "reshaped" anything at all. People say that a lot, but I think it's a lot of hot air. itunes sucks so their "selling music" revolution similarly sucks.

And, as pointed out, the vast majority of iphone's parts are made by samsung so who's innovating again then?

Also as pointed out prior, apple has already lost this same lawsuit in 5+ other countries. It took a tainted jury in the US to get the outcome they were looking for. Not exactly a resounding vindication for the apple fan crowed.


Kn.

[phat-phur-knee]

Originally Posted by switch

Rounded corners on icons?

and don't forget glass to the edge and rounded corners on the phone! Holy F. What were they supposed to do, have nice square corners with razor blades embedded? If you're gonna use Gorilla Glass of course you're going to maximize your screen, which makes iPhone look puny BTW. Anyone know if Apple uses Corning Gorilla too?
I have a Samsung S2 4G and I love it. All the hipsters at work with their iPhones are envious, you can just see it on their faces.

[Fast Orange]

Originally Posted by phat-phur-knee

I have a Samsung S2 4G and I love it. All the hipsters at work with their iPhones are envious, you can just see it on their faces.

Who's the hipster now?

[Adam West]

Originally Posted by Fast Orange

Who's the hipster now?

the guy with the giant phone obviously.

[ADS]

Originally Posted by phat-phur-knee

and don't forget glass to the edge and rounded corners on the phone! Holy F. What were they supposed to do, have nice square corners with razor blades embedded? If you're gonna use Gorilla Glass of course you're going to maximize your screen, which makes iPhone look puny BTW. Anyone know if Apple uses Corning Gorilla too?
I have a Samsung S2 4G and I love it. All the hipsters at work with their iPhones are envious, you can just see it on their faces.

Gorilla Glass: Affirmative

Apple famously has stated that 3.5" is the perfect size however and that anything bigger is apparently too big to use one handed. They have put out numerous diagrams showing the range of the average thumb across the screen such as this one:

“3.5 inch handset size is the “sweet spot” for mobile phone design; big enough to produce detailed, legible graphics, but small enough to fit comfortably in the hand and pocket.” --Steve Jobs

They have also stated that any phone with a bigger screen will ultimately fail because the consumer will find it unusable in the end.

Now you watch how big the screen on the new iPhone will be. I'll happily wager it will be bigger than 3.5 inches.

[switch]

Can't wait for the marketing spin on the new version of the iPhone that'll come out in a couple weeks.

[KenN]

Originally Posted by ADS

They have also stated that any phone with a bigger screen will ultimately fail because the consumer will find it unusable in the end.

Telling the buyer what they want, then telling them they're stupid if they want something else - always a winning long-term marketing strategy.


Kn.

[IFO]

ha..

the iphone screen is hardly ideal.

my samsung infuse was bigger and i lusted after even more..

hello Galaxy note. you lovely big bastard.

now this is a screen. i fukn love the size is this thing

[ADS]

Originally Posted by switch

Can't wait for the marketing spin on the new version of the iPhone that'll come out in a couple weeks.

Well hey if you want to play that game here's another great quote we can take a look at:

If you take an iPad and hold it upright in portrait view and draw an imaginary horizontal line halfway down the screen, the screens on the seven-inch tablets are a bit smaller than the bottom half of the iPad display. This size isn't sufficient to create great tablet apps in our opinion.

Well, one could increase the resolution of the display to make up for some of the difference. It is meaningless, unless your tablet also includes sandpaper, so that the user can sand down their fingers to around one quarter of the present size. Apple's done extensive user-testing on touch interfaces over many years, and we really understand this stuff. There are clear limits of how close you can physically place elements on a touch screen before users cannot reliably tap, flick, or pinch them. This is one of the key reasons we think the 10-inch screen size is the minimum size required to create great tablet apps.

Third, every tablet user is also a smartphone user. No tablet can compete with the mobility of a smartphone, its ease of fitting into your pocket or purse, its unobtrusiveness when used in a crowd. Given that all tablet users will already have a smartphone in their pockets, giving up precious display area to fit a tablet in our pockets is clearly the wrong trade-off. The 7-inch tablets are tweeners, too big to compete with a smartphone and too small to compete with an iPad.

Fourth, almost all of these new tablets use Android software, but even Google is telling the tablet manufacturers not to use their current release, Froyo, for tablets, and to wait for a special tablet release next year. What does it mean when your software supplier does not (inaudible) to use their software in your tablet? And what does it mean when you ignore them and use it anyway?

Fifth, iPad now has over 35,000 apps on the App Store. This new crop of tablets will have near zero. And sixth and last, our potential competitors are having a tough time coming close to iPad's pricing, even with their far smaller, far less expensive screens. The iPad incorporates everything we have learned about building high value products from iPhones, iPods, and Macs. We create our own A4 chip, our own software, our own battery chemistry, our own enclosure, our own everything. And this results in an incredible product at a great price. The proof of this will be in the pricing of our competitor's products, which will likely offer less for more.

These are among the reasons we think the current crop of 7-inch tablets are going to be DOA, dead on arrival. Their manufacturers will learn the painful lesson that their tablets are too small and increase the size next year, thereby abandoning both customers and developers who jumped on the 7-inch bandwagon with an orphan product. Sounds like lots of fun ahead.

--Steve Jobs

Keep in mind points 4 and 5 have already been eliminated and remember this quote when the 7-inch iPad Mini comes out later in the year and 7 inches becomes the ultimate 'fits in your pocket' screen size that was innovated by the ol' boys at Cupertino.

I really have nothing against Apple devices, they're nice and I don't care what my friends' preferences in smartphones are. But the infallible arrogance and marketing spin they bring by not only not empowering consumers but actually creating and then monetizing their ignorance(also known as the Reality Distortion Field), makes them one of my least favourite companies out there. This court case goes well beyond Apple and into patent law itself, however this is the exact kind of thing they do that grinds my gears.

[switch]

Originally Posted by ADS

Now you watch how big the screen on the new iPhone will be. I'll happily wager it will be bigger than 3.5 inches.

4". Same width, but taller. You can get an extra row of icons on the home screen.

[biggles604]

Originally Posted by switch

4". Same width, but taller. You can get an extra row of icons on the home screen.

And they will come up with a douchey marketing name like "Instinctual" and sell it as a feature (that will then be patented, and anyone who goes into their droid OS and changes the number of homescreen rows will then be sued, publicly humiliated and then flagellated.)

[HIBuLlitT]

The anti-Apple guys are as bad as the pro-non-apple guys are. And when I say bad I mean
irritating. The reality is everyone that argues the other is worse/bad that buys one or
the other wants to believe they bought the best one so will think and make up whatever
bullshit makes them feel better. Same with the selling of the brands, they all sell and
say the same bullshit and if you think it's not bullshit you live in a fantasy world.

Apple patented certain things, if Samsung didn't believe it should be a patent, they are
far from being a small player on the scene and could have fought the patent easily right
from the start.

Samsung has 65,000 patents vs Apple who has 9,000, they know about patents and should
have avoided this issue. Samsung 2011 = $140,000,000,000 USD (160trillion KRW) Apple
2011 = $100,000,000,000 USD so I'm not sure where anyone gets the idea that the "big
bad Apple" is trying to squash the "little" guy.

Samsung knew what they were doing, thought they'd get away with copying the design (in
the very least) of the ipads and iphones and got caught. For the people saying how you
can patent something that is "intuitive" or everyone uses...Apple made that happen. I
didn't think that I should be able to use two finger photo manipulation on my 286 Dell
laptop. Whether their Apple guys made that happen or Apple bought the rights/patents
is besides the point...they were the ones to do it, and should profit from it. Don't like
it make it better and patent it. Making it just a little bigger or smaller doesn't make
it unique, just bigger or smaller.

I could have gone either way, but the reality is I need to use a otter case for my phone
due to work, and the iphone is bulky enough as it is, that and I already have an mac
I decided to make life easy on myself. For me, right now, the iphone is the best. I don't
waive it around, nor do I really use it in public except to answer a call or find my
way when I get lost. So, unless they frequent this board, my friends probably don't
even know what kind of phone I use.