New Cranks: Saint Vs. Diabolus

[Chief]

well title pretty much says it
looking for stiff new cranks
external BB.

how do the bearings compare?
stiffness?
user preference

diabolus is going to cost me a bit more
going to be run with a e13

[schoenrock]

i own 2 sets of saints, my first set is hitting its 3rd season on the original bearings with no sign of wear yet and the second set on the other bike is flawless as well. they fit fine with my e.13, easy to install and remove, simple, stiff, best cranks i've owned and they can be cheap($250 new) if you shop around.

[apeshape]

I have both on two bikes and they perform the same but I prefer the Saint. They are a little lighter than the RF but just as stiff and I think they look nicer.

I've moved the Saints from bike to bike to bike over 2 years and been happy every minute I've been on them. Late last year I finally got some play and Cove swapped the bearing out quickly and for minimal cost.

And I'm running an E13 too. You have to fiddle with the fit a bit but they match up just fine.

[jonny.zee]

Saints are prolly a bit lighter, but do they have steel pedal inserts, not sure? The RF bb threads deeper into your bb shell which is a good thing.

As for bearing quality - Shimano's are better, smoother, and from what I've heard more durable.

RF comes in Shiny silver if that's your thing.

[seand]

Read up on this for some nice info regarding the bearings used in each.

Thanks to thedude for posting this in an older thread :)

http://www.peterverdonedesigns.com/bikebottombrackets.htm

[smoochy]

Saint.
hollow construction is better suited (than I-beam) for torsional loads seen by cranks.
pre-load and pinch mounting is far simpler and robust than the silly X-type stuff RF uses.
better bearings.
cheaper.
can look through the axle.

two sets, two years, zero trouble.

[Hack On Wheels]

can look through the axle.


Definitely the best part (atleast for those who are easily amused).

[smoochy]

Definitely the best part (atleast for those who are easily amused).

'sactually pretty satisfying at the end of a ride when you put your bike on the roof-rack and you can see your buddy on the other side of the car. um, through your axle. if you stand on your toes...

[Bryce]

I have Diabolus and I've never tried Saints, therefore my educated opinion is that Diabolus are better.

Kidding. Honestly, if were to buy new cranks today and they were the same price I'd go for the Saints. They're lighter, they come with better bearings, they are easier to install (they have the pinch bolts like XT right?), and they seem to be just as tough as Diabolus. I dunno which is stiffer but you'd probably have to be a giant ape on pcp to really flex either one

[TheGiggler]

^^ ya saints have pinch bolts like XT

saints on my bikes 'fo sho ...

[Chief]

yeah i was already leaning towards saint's ive had diabolus and my road bike has ultegra so its the same system.
i think im going to get the saints.
there pretty cheap off ebay

[Hack On Wheels]

Or you could get Hones...;)

[Chief]

no.
deffinetly not pimp enough for my bike

[IFO]

i run Saint cranks and def prefer them to Diabolous...

go with the Shimano X-type u cant go wrong...

[SkunkworkS]

I've run the Saints and the Eolve X-type.

Saint hands down. Way better system than the RF, and no $2 Chinese bearings.

[connor]

those new Truvativs loook aweeeesome... Holzfeller OCT

[smoochy]

yeah, the new truvativs (OCT) are pimp, but they still use the splined interface fit BB. outboard bearings, yes, but the mounting is reminicent of using a quill stem.
preload and pinch, both sides for all i care, just knock it off with the spline interface!

[Adam West]

saints hands down
hones are great too.

[M@M]

i have a question about bb's, a stupid one at that...is it possible to get shimano bearings put into your diabolus bb? one of the bikes im currently looking at has diabolus cranks on it, and hearing all this apparent bad press makes me a little nervous...

[sampo]

I know that you can use the raceface diabolus BB with Saints, so I assume it works the other way around as well?

[M@M]

I know that you can use the raceface diabolus BB with Saints, so I assume it works the other way around as well?
yeah, i knew that you could use the bb, but i mean the acutal bearings themselves.

[SkunkworkS]

Just punch out the bearing and press a new one from BC Bearings in.

[ZHendo]

Saint, RF makes crappy bearings, but their cranks are strong, if you like the Diabolus better, get a Shimano BB right away instead of the RF poopy ones

[corey@nsmb.com]

Saint. Lighter. Just as strong. Better bearings that last longer.

[Air Supplier]

Get the raceface, I have had both and I rather have raceface. The saint cranks are too hollow (felt them bending) and the bearings I had on the saint only lasted about a year and a half. I still need to find out how long my X-type BB lasts.

[Chief]

well i liked the diabolus while i had them.
but i think im going to go for the saints cheaper and the bearing supposeedly last longer so why not

[MIKAS]

Get the raceface, I have had both and I rather have raceface. The saint cranks are too hollow (felt them bending) and the bearings I had on the saint only lasted about a year and a half. I still need to find out how long my X-type BB lasts.

What a dumb reply !

[Hack On Wheels]

What a dumb reply !

What a pointless post, either disagree and point something constructive out or just don't bother. He has an opinion too, so suck it up.

Btw, I never had a problem with my raceface bb and the cranks were plenty stiff (evolve dh) but I only had them for a short while. The Hones I have now also feel great, although they might be slightly less stiff (Saint will be stiffer) but that isn't very noticeable and the bb is stil running smoothly. The Saint cranks and bb on my dads bike have been running fine for 2 years, no problems, and I have never noticed them to be anything but stiff.

[Jerry-Rig]

The saint cranks are too hollow (felt them bending)

yeah right.....

[SysCo.]

The saint cranks are too hollow (felt them bending)


Your lifes a damn joke.

[ESHER SHORE]

had RF Diablous last year...bearings = sh*te, I all remember on way up Fromme fireroad was horrible graunching noises, and hard to keep cranks on the axle..kept coming loose, very hard to work on, pain in ar*e!!

then had cheapo Shimano Hones, great cranks, no problems with fitting, bearings run smooth for long time

loads of friends running Saint, no problems about 1/3rd cheaper than Diablous , lighter and feel as solid to pedal on

currently running Truvativ Holzfellers Howizters....huge bearings, no problems yet, feel solid when stamping down power..

but don't see why they don't go to 2 piece design like Shimano and RF...there's not a whole lot of axle sticking out the b.b. for the crank arms to screw down onto?

heard of several magazine bike tests here in UK with Truvativ crank arms falling off repeatedly

[sampo]

I've been running saints for 18 months, still on original BB. Stiff, weight is reasonable, seem to be bombproof. I just dont see why anybody would buy the diabolus given the price difference, except for the 'bling' factor - whatever.

[Jerry-Rig]

but don't see why they don't go to 2 piece design like Shimano and RF...there's not a whole lot of axle sticking out the b.b. for the crank arms to screw down onto?

3 piece design because its simpler, lighter, stiffer and stronger than splines

[seand]

Get the raceface, I have had both and I rather have raceface. The saint cranks are too hollow (felt them bending) and the bearings I had on the saint only lasted about a year and a half.


Either..

1 - you are doing things on a bike that nobody has even dreamed of
2 - you weight a cubic ton
3 - you have no idea which way is up.

Definitely a first hearing someone say "I felt my saints bending". Just curious how long until you were aware of this bending? Which happened first, the bending or the bearings blowing? I would hate to think someone rode a crankset that was bending. What did shimano say when you sent in your bending saints?

[smoochy]

3 piece design because its simpler, lighter, stiffer and stronger than splines

i doubt that three-piece is any of these - the integrated two-piece (axle permanently attached to one of the crank arms, a la saint or diabolous) beats the truvativ two-cranks-on-a-BB design anyday. truvativ is probably sticking to their design in an effort to 1) differentiate themselves in the market and 2) keep the system modular (ie: if you break an axle, you just swap the $50 BB).

[zahgurim]

I've been rocking the Saints since they came out, and I am more than happy with them.
Am still on the original set of bearings, and they are still running like they first day I installed them.
A couple very minor but fixable problems, all at the same time: The plastic piece to load the bearings broke. I installed an aftermarket alu piece and no problems since. It broke due to the arm wiggling/sliding on the axle a bit on a drop. I replaced the crappy short pinchbolts with some longer stainless units; now have a much stronger interface, no wiggling since.

I say go for the Saints. Lighter and cheaper, with better construction.
Jenson still has them on for $175, which is a retarded good price.

http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/CR703A03-Shimano+Saint+Crankset+Triple.aspx

[nick]

i have the diabolus for well over a year, ride lots. never had a problem, same bb since day one. i dont get what's up with all the race face bashing on this board? mabe i'm just lucky and got the only pair of cranks that they made that are good! cool!!!

[seand]

i have the diabolus for well over a year, ride lots. never had a problem, same bb since day one. i dont get what's up with all the race face bashing on this board? mabe i'm just lucky and got the only pair of cranks that they made that are good! cool!!!


nah, I wailed on the same raceface ns dh cranks for years and they never gave...sure the bb was changed a few times, but the cranks were solid as solid gets.

[nouseforaname]

Read up on this for some nice info regarding the bearings used in each.

Thanks to thedude for posting this in an older thread :)

http://www.peterverdonedesigns.com/bikebottombrackets.htm

enduro is now selling replacement bearings and tools to do this - avail thru orange sport. So avail thru your LBS. I wonder how the enduro bearings stack up compared with the OEM spec?

[Bryce]

yeah, the new truvativs (OCT) are pimp, but they still use the splined interface fit BB. outboard bearings, yes, but the mounting is reminicent of using a quill stem.
preload and pinch, both sides for all i care, just knock it off with the spline interface!

hmmm, true. I was just about to suggest those new Holzfellers but I forgot about the isis interface. Lotta good the dope arms do when they're wiggling loose and messing up the splines

regarding RF bearings, they last decently in dry weather but just a couple wet days and they start to bind. Like this morning I grabbed my bike (after putting it away nice and wet a couple days ago) and the cranks barely spun, had to spin em for a little while to get them semi-smooth. Glad I'm not pedalling up today

[peachy-B]

the ones at jenson are only limited to the 175mm length.

the enduro bearings doesn't have the plastic sleeve so the spindle is in direct contact w/ the inner bearing race. i'm not sure if this is good. i think the plastic sleeve would provide less noise somehow. better grease it (porn star) lots 'coz u dnt want the spindle and race rusting together.... then u'll have a massive pain trying to pull that crank back out. not sold on the enduro solution. i rather buy the direct replacement ones from BC Bearings and re-use the plastic sleeve.

does anyone know if we can buy those plastic sleeves?

[Desloc]

Sound like either cranks will do the job... as long as you go with a Shimano X-type BB :)


Des

[Jerry-Rig]

i doubt that three-piece is any of these - the integrated two-piece (axle permanently attached to one of the crank arms, a la saint or diabolous) beats the truvativ two-cranks-on-a-BB design anyday. truvativ is probably sticking to their design in an effort to 1) differentiate themselves in the market and 2) keep the system modular (ie: if you break an axle, you just swap the $50 BB).

my bad... I was referring to the Saints being better than the splines