cyclocross/touring frames

[coolie]

hey all, looking at getting a road bike for mostly day riding, but also for sometime touring use. don't plan on riding it off-road at all. would like to be able to fit fenders, racks, and ~28c tires, and run a triple crankset.

looking at the soma double cross, soma smoothie ES, jamis nova, jamis satellite, and old used road frames (miyata would be nice). think spreading a frame from 126mm rear spacing to 130mm is sketchy? we used to do it all the time at the shop i worked at, but a friend of mine suspects he cracked his frame at the dropouts because of the spreading.

anyway, think cantis are really needed for touring? i've only ever toured on an MTB with v-brakes. anyone ever hauled a heavily-loaded bike with caliper brakes?

any input on frames or designs i should look at?

[thewalrus]

there's a Fuji cross frame you might be interested in...

Trek Portland/LeMond Poprad Disc (same frame), available with cantis or avid BB7 160mm disc brakes.

[coolie]

the fuji's ugly :) the lemond is nice though, esp. since it's made of 853. i have a feeling both are out of my price range though.

[Wayne P]

Kim Steed rides a Poprad and loves it. A couple of his team riders use them for racing as well. Kim might be looking at selling his (I'm not sure though).

kim@steedcycles.com

[coolie]

thanks, but i need a 50-51cm frame.

[Late Bloomer]

Have you checked into the Surly Cross Check or the Gunnar Crosshairs? Solid rides, IMHO.
You can run v-brakes on a 'cross bike, but it involves hooking up those pulley systems which can be a total pain at times. They're bliss if you can get them to cooperate.

[sanrensho]

You can also order in a Kona 'cross frame, assuming availability in their warehouse. 130mm OLD. Although I suspect you're not interested in riding a Kona.

I personally haven't found it a problem using the V-brake adapters.

[thewalrus]

might be outside your price range, but here's a Ridley Crosswind (Belgian). If anybody knows CX bikes, it's the Belgians...

http://www.galaxycles.com/ridley/017_CrosswindDCR.JPG

[coolie]

Have you checked into the Surly Cross Check or the Gunnar Crosshairs? Solid rides, IMHO.
You can run v-brakes on a 'cross bike, but it involves hooking up those pulley systems which can be a total pain at times. They're bliss if you can get them to cooperate.

don't think i could afford a gunnar since they're waterford pedigree. surly's not bad, like the colours, but for about the same price i can get a reynolds-tubed soma.

i don't think i really need to run v-brakes, am happy running cantilevers. the cable routing on the pulley systems is inefficient, and the dia-compe levers that have v-brake cable pull are not very durable.

any one toured with calipers though?

[coolie]

You can also order in a Kona 'cross frame, assuming availability in their warehouse. 130mm OLD. Although I suspect you're not interested in riding a Kona.

I personally haven't found it a problem using the V-brake adapters.

no, i'm down with kona. i'd prefer to ride steel but oh well, i have an older cro-mo cinder cone that i totally love.

so it sounds like people aren't steering me away from a cross frame even though i'm not going to be riding off-road on the road bike...

[coolie]

do you usually size road bikes to have shorter top tubes than MTBs because you're usually stretched out to the brake hoods?

[sanrensho]

A road bike position is usually more stretched out due to the aero emphasis. However, it doesn't necessarily have to be that way. Go with whatever feels comfortable for you, especially if you are commuting and prefer a more "heads up" position.

I'm assuming that you've punched your body measurements into a fit calculator (see the stickied thread), since you've already picked out a frame size.

For the Kona option, visit a dealer and get them to phone up Kona on the spot. They should be able to find out in a matter of minutes if they have any frames in your size.

Also, you have the option of cross levers to mitigate the extra reach from drop bars. IMO, these are extremely useful in traffic (hand-signaling and braking at the same time).

[coolie]

I'm assuming that you've punched your body measurements into a fit calculator (see the stickied thread), since you've already picked out a frame size.


no, i hadn't. i'll give it a shot. i just went to la bicicletta and shoved a piece of wood they have in my junk to measure my inseam and the guy said 50-52cm is good.

[Joe Dick]

I just picked up a Kona Jake the Snake. don't have it yet, but I bought it for just what you are taking about. if you can wait a couple week for me to recive it and put a few miles on it, I'll galdly give you my 2c. but till then...

another way to go is the Kona Sutra, thier touring frame, but it's steel, so if you riding a lot on foul weather, it may not be the way to go. it does come with disk brakes though, as does the Major Jake.

[sanrensho]

i just went to la bicicletta and shoved a piece of wood they have in my junk to measure my inseam and the guy said 50-52cm is good.

FWIW, my inseam is 77.5 cm and I ride a 49 cm Kona Jake frame.

[Mitch]

Go see Ed @ Mighty Riders... Unless of course you've already been, seeing as you're all "Soma this" and "Surly that" !

;)

He also has a mint Brodie Romax 50cm hanging there w. fork...

[coolie]

Go see Ed @ Mighty Riders... Unless of course you've already been, seeing as you're all "Soma this" and "Surly that" !

;)

He also has a mint Brodie Romax 50cm hanging there w. fork...

yeah, you get a lot of surly there... thanks for the tip on the brodie.

[coolie]

FWIW, my inseam is 77.5 cm and I ride a 49 cm Kona Jake frame.

you must have tons of standover then?

were you on clark and 5th or so at 8am today? saw a guy with a blue jacket and a 2006 kona jake today.

[sanrensho]

you must have tons of standover then?

were you on clark and 5th or so at 8am today? saw a guy with a blue jacket and a 2006 kona jake today.

Nope, wasn't me. I'm on an '04 Jake (Gray/Black).

I have barely any standover, maybe 1-2 cm at most. And this is wearing mtb shoes with lugged soles. I have about 10 cm of seat post extension showing.

'Cross frames typically have a higher BB/standover. Compared with the same size Kona road frame, the BB on my bike is 0.5 inches higher and the standover is 1.3 inches higher.

Also, when you measure your inseam, make sure to push up right into your junk.

[coolie]

'Cross frames typically have a higher BB/standover. Compared with the same size Kona road frame, the BB on my bike is 0.5 inches higher and the standover is 1.3 inches higher.

Also, when you measure your inseam, make sure to push up right into your junk.

don't worry, i'm all about pushing it up, down, and all around.

currently looking at a more traditional road frame on ebay and it's sized 51 cm seat tube and 52.4 cm top tube, but according to zinn i'm built like a monkey with a long torso and short legs - think march of the penguins. does that mean i'm committed to riding bikes that i can barely straddle but with a super long stem so i get the proper extension?

[sanrensho]

currently looking at a more traditional road frame on ebay and it's sized 51 cm seat tube and 52.4 cm top tube, but according to zinn i'm built like a monkey with a long torso and short legs - think march of the penguins. does that mean i'm committed to riding bikes that i can barely straddle but with a super long stem so i get the proper extension?

Let me get back to you on the sizing issue, but I really think you're better off buying locally so you can check the sizing. A couple of budget 50-51 cm bikes have appeared lately, now is a good time to buy with motivated sellers.

51 cm 'cross frame, but with flat bars:

http://www.cycling.bc.ca/index.php?id=173&tt_board_uid=4117&cHash=824003d11c

50 cm road frame:

http://vancouver.craigslist.org/bik/126260254.html

[coolie]

cool, thanks for the leads. i checked the cannondale website and the standover on their 50cm cross frame is 31.6". not too in to standing on tippy-toes every stop light. and the one essential thing i need on a road bike is that it can mount proper full-fenders, so neither of those bikes apply (the cross frame has no fender mounts!). rainy road rides while breathing froth is the shit. thanks though, i'll keep an eye on that site and i bid on the road frame on ebay, so we'll find out in a couple hours.

[thewalrus]

Salsa Las Cruces, with 51mm IS disc mounts

http://www.fullcycles.com/images/salsa-las-cruces-cyclo-cross.jpg

[coolie]

man, we have totally different tastes in bikes, unless you're showing me that to show me an ugly bike. salsa used to be hot, now it's past due.

[XXX_er]

http://www.lemondbikes.com/2006_bikes/poprad_disc.shtml

we just got in one of these

disc mount on the chainstay instead of seat stay is kinda unusual

[switch]

Today I saw some road frames at Sports Junkies in Port Moody, but they were probably all aluminum. Pretty good place to find the odd part or decent old frame, nonetheless.

The Jake is a decent frame - sanrensho's Jake is built pretty light - maybe 20 lbs.

[coolie]

The Jake is a decent frame - sanrensho's Jake is built pretty light - maybe 20 lbs.

cool, is it built more for road?

[sanrensho]

cool, is it built more for road?

The bike is a standard 'cross build except for lighter wheels (handbuilt w/Velocity Aerohead rims) and tires. Knobbies and heavier duty wheels would push the weight up another 1-2 lb.

Sorry for not getting back to you on the sizing issue. Minimal top tube clearance shouldn't be as big an issue on a road bike. Hopefully, you won't be dismounting that often. If frequent dismounts are a concern (such as for commuting), then an mtb frame might make more sense.

As far as using long stems, you might be surprised. You may find that you prefer a shorter/taller stem for a more upright position. The numbers you will get from an online fit calculator are only guideline recommendations. However, I would use the recommended seat height measurement as a starting point and experiment from there (+/- 1 cm) if you find it necessary.

[Oldfart]

I wouldn't recommend a true cross bike for touring. The high bb is not only a little less stable (not that big a deal to me) but that might mean that the bars end up lower relative to the saddle than optimal for long tours. I would suggest reading the fit opinions on the Rivendell http://www.rivendellbicycles.com/html/101_pureopinions.html

website before you go further. Another thing is that many cross bikes have no rack mounts and a real cross bike like that beautiful Ridley, does not even have bottle mounts.

I had a Jake, first generation 49cm. No fender eyelets on the fork and short front centre which means toe overlap with the front wheel. I had all the spacers I could reasonably fit under a 80mm 10 degree rise stem and it was still a bit low for my tastes. I would suggest either long reach sidepulls or canti's over v's and pulleys. I tried the pulley thing and it did not work all that great for me. There are also tektro mini-v's too which do work pretty well.

[XXX_er]

how about the Strange brake?

http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/strangebrakes.asp

I think they may be making another run of these