Crist strikes again

[Think Fast Hippie]

http://www.canada.com/vancouver/vancouversun/news/westcoastnews/story.html?id=250cf3db-23a7-4974-9092-5cacbfa7d4ee

Perhaps he should lobby for some money so the area can be built to withstand the traffic???

[Gyropractor]

We should just need to wait until he dies, then it will all go away.



One serious prick out of a million.

[Mountain Dewd]

he really seems nuts...

[hooli]

i don't even know where that park is...and i ride fromme all the time...this guy should spend more time harrassing district workers :rolleyes:

[Smoke]

Can someone post the whole article?

I think an investigation would be a good thing. It would prove what we have been saying all along. Bikes have an impact, but it's no different than all the people walking around, or kids playing, or dogs,etc. It would quite likely exonerate us and show us for the responsible users that we all really are.

[bighitbikerNS]

The same thing goes on here in calgary. They want to close nose hill to bikers, funny thing there is hardly any up there. The say our "large" tires eat away at the soil at very fast rate and can erode upto on foot thick os soil per year on a highly used trail. Its BS.

[Keefer]

Councillor wants probe into alleged damage in Mountain View Park
NORTH VANCOUVER DISTRICT - Veteran district Coun. Ernie Crist wants municipal staff to report back on alleged damage in Mountain View Park that he says is due to mountain bikers.

Is that the whole article??

[Think Fast Hippie]

Pretty much.... It was a little blurb on the second page of the West Coast section I think. The part where they do a one paragraph tour of news from the whole lower mainland. It doesn't say much when a sabre rattling old fart gets the press.

[dirty deeds]

I'm so sick of reading and listening to his verbal diarrhea. His plan is to just keep on and on and on about how evil mtb's are until DNV give in to him just to shut him up. Anyone in North Van who can vote.. you know what you've got to do.. until then just keep sending well written letters to everyone else on Council opposing his position.

[Think Fast Hippie]

Originally posted by dirty deeds
I'm so sick of reading and listening to his verbal diarrhea. His plan is to just keep on and on and on about how evil mtb's are until DNV give in to him just to shut him up. Anyone in North Van who can vote.. you know what you've got to do.. until then just keep sending well written letters to everyone else on Council opposing his position.

I agree fully... that's what ticks me off. Is how this idiot is the one who makes it to the Vancouver Sun. Is his personal crusade against MTBers the only news in the district????

[Zedbra]

There is a good write up about this in the newest Bike magazine - a University in the States did research on this - proved that biking was no differnet on environmental impact - in fact, horses were worse.

[Zaskar]

maybe ernie crist should organize some forced labour and send us all to to his gulags and BUILD him this "wonderful new spectacular" bike park in the middle of no where.

oh wait? they've already got free labour. but i'm sure this is all about ernie wanting to crack whips behind little boys with shovels...if you get my drift. that dude seriously pisses me off.

jeez im lost. his commie ways just don't work for me. maybe he should go back to actually doing his homework, instead of pulling all eight inches of facts sheets out of his ass....i think his crazy old man attitude should stop talking about "environmental impact"...you never know what hes thinking.

PS. what party is Ernie running under? :???: i know he was commie back in the day but what is he now?

[Battlecat]

one word for this guy


big fat loser that doesnt get none so he ruines everyone elses fun




i think that is one word

[TheGiggler]

Councillor wants probe into alleged damage in Mountain View Park

Vancouver Sun

Tuesday, June 22, 2004


NORTH VANCOUVER DISTRICT - Veteran district Coun. Ernie Crist wants municipal staff to report back on alleged damage in Mountain View Park that he says is due to mountain bikers.

Crist is calling on fellow councillors to back his call for a report on the state of the Lynn Valley area park at an upcoming council meeting.

He says the bikers are following council's advice and using the park to gain access to the forested hillside on Fromme Mountain and Grouse Mountain. However, Crist says so many bikers are using the park, it is being ruined.
© The Vancouver Sun 2004



thankfully the rest of council don't share his views.

[M13]

we have a little local BUSH here:mad:

hopefully hes OUT after the elections

[bunny]

classic. we are following council's advice.

[derwood]

One good thing about Crist though,his out there comments have inspired council and all of us to find a REAL solution to Fromme access problems and trail use.:)

[KING-OF E-VILLE]

I was in there last night, and I could not see any damage at all. Wait, thats not true, there was one deep tire mark in an off camber soft/loose gravel downgrade turn, but it was unavoidable, this stuff will stop once the trail packs down. All this "rider hater" stuff is rediculous. The Bikers are the #1 user group on Fromme. If democracy rules, then District Policy should be in Favour of Bike related issues, Not one crazy old man and 2 hikers.

I think NSMBA should put some staff/volunteers in the MountainView Park ( And at the Access GAte at the top of Mountain Highway) for a few weekends from sun-up to Sun-Set. and just count the number and type users in the forest. I bet it would be like 80% bikers, 8% runners, 5% dog walkers and AND only 7% hikers, Yet all the policy in the District is for Hikers. I don't get it.

Democracy rules, and 80% is a landslide victory. But I'm Dreaming

What do you think NSMBA. I'll volunteer for a 2 hour shift in MountainView.

[Couch_Surfer]

let's not make this into riders vs. hikers. the vast majority of the hikers i meet on fromme are super cool. i stop chat with them, they chat back it's all good.

are we using trails more then them? maybe, but even if we are let's not try and take a 'holier then thou' approach about it - that just pisses everyone off.

we all know crist is a nutcase - just keep the political pressure strong whenever he spouts off

[LeeLau]

Hey king - already done. Surveys were done about a summer ago. I think Sharon has the results but she'll be away for 3 weeks or so. Ernie's just doing his job = stirring the pot

[hooli]

the last time i rode up fromme i was accosted...by a pack of dogs(8 of them) off leash being walked by a professional dog walker...upon continuation of my ride up(i hadn't even hit the van tan club yet)i counted at least a dozen dog poops...nowhere did i see any biker impact(except for a power bar wrapper which i picked up)...now i'm sure the dog walker picked up her dogs poopies but it left me wondering whos dogs poop up here and i came to the conclusion it may be residents dogs being walked up there since it is so convienient....does dog shit not have the same impact on some people as a tire rut or two thru a park have on others...next election time we need to vote out these narrow minded politicians and elect progressive thinkers who can come up with solutions to try and reach a compromise to please the majority of people not just the vocal and nutty minority....end rant

hooli for councillor...coming to nvd election booths 2006

[Team2K]

Originally posted by Zedbra
There is a good write up about this in the newest Bike magazine - a University in the States did research on this - proved that biking was no differnet on environmental impact - in fact, horses were worse.

I think this is the report generated by the research to which you refer...

http://www.imba.com/resources/science/impact_summary.html

here's the conclusion:


Conclusion
Mountain biking, like other recreation activities, does impact the environment. On this point, there is little argument. But with regard to the non-human environment, people often debate whether or not mountain bikes cause more damage to trails, vegetation, and wildlife than other forms of recreation such as hiking and horseback riding.

A body of empirical, scientific studies now indicates that mountain biking is no more damaging than other forms of recreation, including hiking. Thus, managers who prohibit bicycle use (while allowing hiking or equestrian use) based on impacts to trails, soils, wildlife, or vegetation are acting without sound, scientific backing.

In contrast, if a manager prohibits one user group on the basis of providing a particular type of experience for another group, the evidence provided by social studies may or may not justify that decision. The wisdom of prohibiting particular user groups in order to satisfy the desires of other groups is a matter for politics rather than science.

[Putty]

two words: regime change

[seand]

Originally posted by BP
one word for this guy


big fat loser that doesnt get none so he ruines everyone elses fun




i think that is one word


hey captain math, thats more than one word :)





the issues surrounding christ amuse me because of the level of rediculousness it emcompasses; much like the baboon that heads the states. atleast christ doesnt have the power to execute bikers; yet.

amazing how far the voice of one crazy can carry, eh?

[Bryce]

That Bike article makes some good points and overlooks some as well. We may have equal or even less impact than other forms of trail traffic but we travel further, more frequently, and in greater numbers.

I'd love to say that we impact trails less than hikers overall but there's contrary evidence everywhere. Our trails look like shit, from an environmental perspective. Example: the trail on the east side of Lillooet Rd near Lynn Canyon used to be mainly a hiker trail. It was narrow and really loamy and nice. Then an XC event was held there. Now its used more by bikes and it looks like complete shit compared to just 2 years ago. Amazing that hikers could keep it relatively pristine for decades and bikes trashed it in a matter of months. Or look at St George's (an old hiking trail) vs. Starfish (its much newer neighbor). I'm sure there are counter-examples but keep the big picture in mind - hiking trails are much more natural.

As for closing some areas to bikes to preserve the 'trail experience' - thats a good idea too. We ride trails much faster and, for the most part, we're focused on the ground 20 feet ahead, not on scenery or wildlife or flora. Sure, its great to ride in scenic places but a less-scenic trail would be almost as good and it wouldn't compromise the experience for others. How bout we leave the bike at home sometimes and walk?

I know, I sound like a crotchety old hiker. But what I'm saying is true and if you look deep inside, beyond your own personal desires, you'll see it too. We battle hard against trail closures, and sometimes you need to battle unreasonable guys like Crist, but sometimes you also have to concede that maybe we are making more of an impact than we should in some areas. Maybe we should stop riding in areas that are more valuable to hikers and dog walkers. This, in turn, may help take pressure off some of the areas that we really love and that hikers could care less about. Mountain View is a prime example - to us those trails are just exits, to dog-walkers and families it is a natural haven. If we shred it and they get pissed off and complain to council about bikes in general, it puts the good trails in jeopardy of dismantling. I'd rather have to stay on a gravel trail through Mountain View than have UOC or Circus or Starfish closed. One step back and 2 forward.

I know I'm gonna get flamed for this, thats OK. I also know that some people will stop and think. We have to share limited natural resources with other non-bike-compatible uses and we ought to think about where our priorities lie. Thinking that everything should be open to bikes is unreasonably selfish. Lets give them whats important to them so that we can keep what important to us. A reasonable, rational, and considerate position would completely deflate a jackass like Crist.

[Think Fast Hippie]

Bryce, I'm not going to flame you at all. The points you make are very valid. We ride in much greater numbers in a relatively small area, therefore the erosion we cause is very noticeable. In a perfect world I would love to see the GVRD and DNV buck up some cash to maintain the trails (yes even the ones only built for biking) Cities don't seem to have any problem tossing millions of dollars at building new sports fields complete with parking and lights that in reality are only used by a select group of people who play team sports etc. Why is it that they can't toss even a little cash and resources at alleviating what is becoming a serious us against them battle? It just doesn't have to be this way. Well anyway I'll just dream of a day when the DNV and other crafty people realize that there is some serious cash to be made off of mountainbiking and mountainbikers and we get the support and respect that we deserve. Cheers to that:beer: :beer: :drunk:

[Sharon]

I've been riding the camp brick trails for years.

Yes the INCREASED NUMBERS have had an effect.

As a user group, we are doing something about it, we are maintaining the trails we are using.

Fortunately most of the mtb trails are too steep for hiking so impact is mostly by us and conflicts are few. We also actively maintain these trails.

You want to see some sad Hiking trails?
check out the BP paralleling Severed, or Lynn Peak.

Due to the parking issues most hikers and dog walkers access at St. Mary's or Dempsey so it would actually be better at this time if we focus our access at mt. view and mt hwy.

King, see my post in maintenance.

[KING-OF E-VILLE]

Yo Bryce (and anyone who agrees with him)

check out the post under "Maintenance" on "the switchback trail above MVP"

it talks about this same issue that Bryce hit on. We must respect the bottom of the Mountain to save the top.

Hey think fast hippey,

The =District does buck up cash for trail work. the DNV guy just told me today to call him for anything I need to work the Switchbacks.
He is getting a truck load of cedar logs and planks, one ton of boulders and one ton of crushed granite for the trail day on sunday. He fully support the Bikers on Fromme. I'm sure we could get a lot of $'s from the DNV if we can show them (in a professional manner) what we need and why.

[Stinky_Rider]

Originally posted by Zaskar
maybe ernie crist should organize some forced labour and send us all to to his gulags and BUILD him this "wonderful new spectacular" bike park in the middle of no where.

Why don't they make a bunch of hiker's trails in the middle of nowhere, save $ and its easier to build, or why don't these people walk up different trails and mountians, why not go to stanley park!!! Oh well, lets get Christ of the council, don't vote for him next time around, I can't remember the guy who is pro-bikers, maybe someone here does.

[maxipad]

hey everyone, we should definitely do something so i have (not much but all i can do really) i made a thread about this stuff/subject. youll see in the shore forum. anyways, hes so crazy, i cant stand narrow minded poeple and all they do is "bar" their problems away and they dont find a solution so everyone can enjoy it.

anyways, just my 2 cents

[XXX_er]

"crist is a jerk" might make you feel all warm inside for a second just like pissing in yer riding shorts but it doesnt really adress yer problem with access and yer image with joe average tax payer

places like quesnel and willaims lake have gone thru that process

Quensel bike club dealt with all that 4 years ago they had guys who dealt with the city and forestry,built a dual slalom on a power line down to the fairgrounds and all that stuff.Unfortunatley some of the key members moved away and the club doesnt seem so active

Williams lake has trails all over the place,and Mark from Red Shred's is well connected and totaly respected by people in power cuz he does stuff for the community.Sure this guy has dreads but a little old lady with blue hair still told me he's a pillar of the community cuz he is.

We have to go thru this now in P.G.,somebody printed trail maps ,pretty easy in a forestry town ... I probably know 10 GIS techs and an instructor. So now what was hidden and easy to ignore has to be addressed by the city BUT the cycling club which was mainly X-country racer types has virtualy folded and there hasnt been any active cycle club to spearhead landuse/trail access issues for some time.We got some riders who live in north nechako looking after their area but nothing overall.So far free riders are just that and they haven't organised

this isnt about crist ,this is about dealing with landuse/landacess,personaly I have always wondered how y'all got away with the situation on the shore for this long