Natural High and 33DD... What is happening?!?!

[Gazz_Jr]

What is happening to the trails?????

I've noticed that it has been a long time since work started on Natural High... i've also noticed that about half way through the renovation people have stopped working... now the trail is pretty boring as the first ladder is missing a whole bunch of rungs, the second ladder no longer has a gap jump off to the side, the drop/ launch after that is half complete, the bigish drop is lacking a good landing and the rock ridedown is like a 70 degree slope to pretty much flat, the drop after that is almost completely to flat... how could you let such a short trail be ruined in one year... i think that there should be a trail day on a trail like that... because with enough people that trail could be completed, ridable and lots of fun...

Now 33DD.. the trail that starts right b4 simmons gap is screwed... the upper part is marginal and the lower half is messed.. the drops dont even have landings and one of the launches doesnt have a take off and is left with nails pointing out... something should be done...

Lets see if we cant try and get the building of these trails underway again...

Thanks

[Happy Matt]

natural high was built with 2 by 4s, i dont like that....

[Zedbra]

Stop bitchin about it, and get out there and do something about it.

[Sharon]

I guess THEY should do something about it.

Unfortunatly this happens all the time, people start a trail, realize how much hard work it is to maintain then quit.

Best to let these trails get claimed back by the forest, unless THEY are willing to put some serious effort into keeping them in ridable shape.

[Battlecat]

Work on it yourself. If you enjoy it so much and like riding it put some time into it and build it up for yourself

[Keefer]

YOU'VE BEEN IMINATED!

[wilkez]

i thought there were people working on natural high?

and just to let you know, natural high has always been crap like that, it was never really well built. perhaps a trail day there next year is in order...

[Niggz]

Originally posted by wilkez
i thought there were people working on natural high?

and just to let you know, natural high has always been crap like that, it was never really well built. perhaps a trail day there next year is in order...

bah, no point. pointless 2x4 stunts ending up in a screwed up annoying swamp with no way out is not cool. people will stop going down there and then there will be no problems. put a trail day on something usefull like pipeline.

[Jerry-Rig]

tear it all down and make all gap jumps

[|)uR0 .243]

Originally posted by Jerry-Rig
tear it all down and make all gap jumps

theres an idea

[dirty deeds]

Originally posted by |)uR0 .243
theres an idea

Here's the deal. DNV's position is no work on stunts or anything elevated. The DNV says unless you get a permission letter from the guys who 'chatted' with Digger - no trail work.

So I met with the DNV guy to get permission to rebuild Natural High over the winter, because as you know it's in a bad state of disrepair. I had to meet him there, walk the trail and explain the work I wanted to do while he was taking pictures of everything. Let me put it this way... permission will only be given to construct a XC type trail. Rock work and low level bridges over swamps are all that's acceptable. Can't build (or even repair) any elevated stunts, no skinnies. Can't rebuild the gap jumps across the creeks, can't rebuild the on ramp to that elevated drop... nothing that may result in air or riding above ground level. In other words - no fun stuff.

So, lame right. I don't even really want to do it any more, because the result will just be a XC trail between the road and Griffin - BFD.

This is not just for Natural High, by the way - it's the new world order for anything on DNV land at least until they come out with their new long term policy on MTB next year - and maybe for ever after that.

The result - trails will go to shit. Nobody's going to work on them. Maybe now people will realise how much Digger did on his trails. I rode Ladies and LL today and they are already getting chundery and eroded. I don't know if he'll ever go work up there again after the 'meeting'.

So dudes.. be warned. If your building on DNV land and they catch you without a permission letter, your work will be torn down and they'll confiscate your tools.

On the brighter side - it sounds like they won't be tearing down anything that's already established... they just won't allow any maintenance on it if they deem it unacceptable. Some of the trails are on Grouse property and GVRD property and I don't think they have power over them, so check the boundaries at City Hall. Also, I think they probably have other things to do than roam through the forest looking for new stuff.

All's I can say is be careful and discrete if, when and where you build. Don't go posting any pictures on the net (OK, boys).

Chill out for a while. Hopefully everything will work out OK.

[white ri0t]

I've said it before, I'll say it again.

The shore is getting gayer and gayer.

[Zaskar]

Originally posted by dirty deeds
Here's the deal. DNV's position is no work on stunts or anything elevated. The DNV says unless you get a permission letter from the guys who 'chatted' with Digger - no trail work.

So I met with the DNV guy to get permission to rebuild Natural High over the winter, because as you know it's in a bad state of disrepair. I had to meet him there, walk the trail and explain the work I wanted to do while he was taking pictures of everything. Let me put it this way... permission will only be given to construct a XC type trail. Rock work and low level bridges over swamps are all that's acceptable. Can't build (or even repair) any elevated stunts, no skinnies. Can't rebuild the gap jumps across the creeks, can't rebuild the on ramp to that elevated drop... nothing that may result in air or riding above ground level. In other words - no fun stuff.

So, lame right. I don't even really want to do it any more, because the result will just be a XC trail between the road and Griffin - BFD.

This is not just for Natural High, by the way - it's the new world order for anything on DNV land at least until they come out with their new long term policy on MTB next year - and maybe for ever after that.

The result - trails will go to shit. Nobody's going to work on them. Maybe now people will realise how much Digger did on his trails. I rode Ladies and LL today and they are already getting chundery and eroded. I don't know if he'll ever go work up there again after the 'meeting'.

So dudes.. be warned. If your building on DNV land and they catch you without a permission letter, your work will be torn down and they'll confiscate your tools.

On the brighter side - it sounds like they won't be tearing down anything that's already established... they just won't allow any maintenance on it if they deem it unacceptable. Some of the trails are on Grouse property and GVRD property and I don't think they have power over them, so check the boundaries at City Hall. Also, I think they probably have other things to do than roam through the forest looking for new stuff.

All's I can say is be careful and discrete if, when and where you build. Don't go posting any pictures on the net (OK, boys).

Chill out for a while. Hopefully everything will work out OK.

i hate this policy man...since when is trail MAITENANCE a crime.

BTW...i know dan is still building up there. word frm my buddies up there yesterday is that he re-did the first rolldowns rungs on flying circus. they saw him hiking up st george with his chainsaw

[Jerry-Rig]

Circus is on Grouse land, not on DNV.

Grouse actually has quite a bit of land on Fromme. Future trail builders should take a look at the maps as DD mentioned.

I do think the trails below the first switch back should be toned down on stunts.... better for beginners and plus it will make us look better. It should be fast and flowy as it is mostly now.

Here's where I see the future of trail building ...... night building !

Till the DNV writes me up, I'm not gonna stop maintaining and expanding the mayhem we call "the shore".

The shore is about innovation and pushing the limits. I must pursue.

[Zedbra]

Night building constructed a few hidden gems in these parts.

Too bad I won't show you - or post pics!

And nothing is gheyer then you, Digz.

[wilkez]

ok well i guess our trail is screwed nigel lol.

but here's how i see it, if we are not allowed to maintain what's already there it will be MORE dangerous than leaving it. so if the district doesnt want US to work on THEIR trails, then they should be required to maintain them themselves, just like any other city park. becuase if they dont let us maintain them, i see it as they are taking full legal liability for the trails. so when i fall and get hurt because of a lack of maintenence, its the DNV who's gonna have my lawsuit up their ass and they will get a wake up call. im not a lawyer or anything but that makes sense to me...

somebody let me know when there is another one of those meetings about the whole mountain biking deal, i really need to come to one and show them what a couple of 16 year old hicks from surrey can do for them

[Niggz]

I'm scared and confused. And pissed right off!

[ReCkLeSs RiDeR]

yea go hicks:)

[dirty deeds]

Originally posted by Niggz
I'm scared and confused. And pissed right off!

I don't want to alarm you guys too much. I don't think they're going to be tearing anything down (fingers crossed) so you just finished the project in time but maybe keep it low key for a bit... keep pictures off the web. You're justifiably proud of your work but try not to draw too much attention to it right now.

[Niggz]

all our built work is done for a while so yah we should be ok

[Jerry-Rig]

there are to be no man made stunts below the Baden Powell according to the DNV..... I have a feeling the pimp coaster will survive though

[Tonestar]

Maybe it would be a good idea to go in and tear down the "unsafe stunts on Natural High ourselves (NSMBA). Then fix it to become a good beginner trail, don't you think that would give us some good karma with the DNV?

[dirty deeds]

Originally posted by Tonestar
Maybe it would be a good idea to go in and tear down the "unsafe stunts on Natural High ourselves (NSMBA). Then fix it to become a good beginner trail, don't you think that would give us some good karma with the DNV?

Probably a good idea.

I was planning on rebuilding NH as my winter project this year. Then after walking the trail with the guy to get the permission letter it became evident that a XC type trail is all that's acceptable to them. I'm thinking hmmm... do I really want to spend all my time just to end up with a beginner/intermediate type trail between the road and Griffin that I'll probably never ride.

Maybe that's a selfish and short sighted attitude, but that was my immediate reaction.

[trail worker]

ugh natural high was in sad shape when i rode it a year ago,now it's probably even worse...

[Tonestar]

I understand where your coming from, but we as mtn bikers need to look at these things as a way to grow the sport. The more people we can get involved in the sport, the more of a voice we have. I would be happy to go in there with you and tear down the crap that is still standing, then build some easier bridge/ rock work to get over the mud bogs and fallen trees. It is probably not a huge project, but the karma could pay off huge for us.

[dirty deeds]

Originally posted by Tonestar
I understand where your coming from, but we as mtn bikers need to look at these things as a way to grow the sport. The more people we can get involved in the sport, the more of a voice we have. I would be happy to go in there with you and tear down the crap that is still standing, then build some easier bridge/ rock work to get over the mud bogs and fallen trees. It is probably not a huge project, but the karma could pay off huge for us.

Sure. If you PM me your contact numbers I'll let you know when I get the approval letter from the District. 'Policy' is we can't do anything before getting that.

Anyone else also who wants to lend a hand, PM me and maybe we can all meet there one day soon and plan it out.

I think small work groups dedictated to fixing specific trails top to bottom is the way to go.

[Rat]

Natural High is a really a a scar on the mountain biking on fromme. That 2x4 ladder bridge is an eysore and should be pulled down.

I think you could build a great little trail that would be fun without having to build high up there are some fun natural features like the big rock roll that will always be there.

Let me know what comes of it and perhaps I can get somtime to give you a helping hand.

[Rat]

As for 36 DD there was a lot less thought put into the trail than the kicker jumps.

[dirty deeds]

Originally posted by Rat
Let me know what comes of it and perhaps I can get somtime to give you a helping hand.

You're now part of the crew.

[Jon-boy]

I could also lend time to trail building up until Christmas on the weekends. PM me nearer the time.

[Jerry-Rig]

Originally posted by Zedbra


And nothing is gheyer then you, Digz.

One of the stupidest comments I've ever seen.... Quit acting your age.

[synchro]

Originally posted by Jerry-Rig
One of the stupidest comments I've ever seen.... Quit acting your age.

Sorry Jer, but I'm gonna side with Zed on this one. Digz is cool and has lots of funny and smart things to say, but he always wants to slam the shore whenever issues pop up. I don't think most people realize how big the Shore really is, by far the largest recreational riding area on the planet in terms of the k's of technical trails out there. You and me are out there bustin our humps (cause we enjoy building) to make it better and some people always wanna knock it. Apathy sucks.

[Jerry-Rig]

its a dumb comment, plain and simple. He should back up his comment with an argument. Saying someone is ghey is just childish, especially about Diggs. Go to pinkbike if your gonna make ignorant statements.

People should learn to respect.

[synchro]

Originally posted by Jerry-Rig
its a dumb comment, plain and simple. He should back up his comment with an argument. Saying someone is ghey is just childish, especially about Diggs. Go to pinkbike if your gonna make ignorant statements.

People should learn to respect.

Hey bro, it's one of those things where it's esay to split hairs. Derek has made more than his fair share of similar comments, and in light of his and Zed's nature on the board it's not out of line at all. I agree with you on the wordage tho, not fond of using the term ghey like that, something like tool would have been better.

[Tonestar]

Children please, stop. If you have nothing to say about the topic, then get off this posting. Now lets all get together and go and fix NH and all will be well again.

[synchro]

Originally posted by Tonestar
Children please, stop. If you have nothing to say about the topic, then get off this posting. Now lets all get together and go and fix NH and all will be well again.

Uh yeah, like OK. :rolleyes:
When was the last time you were out to do any work btw?

[dirty deeds]

I think maybe Jerry thought Zed was talking about Digger (when in fact he was talking about Derek Diggler who started the gay comment on this thread). I think Zed is just telling Derek Diggler to butt out unless he has something intelligent to add, which is fair enough. Misunderstanding maybe?!?

Whatever, I haven't got the permission to work letter yet, but as soon as I do I'll contact the guys who PM'd me and we'll fix up NH.

[Putty]

building is ghey.

[Jerry-Rig]

Originally posted by dirty deeds
I think maybe Jerry thought Zed was talking about Digger (when in fact he was talking about Derek Diggler who started the gay comment on this thread). I think Zed is just telling Derek Diggler to butt out unless he has something intelligent to add, which is fair enough. Misunderstanding maybe?!?

Whatever, I haven't got the permission to work letter yet, but as soon as I do I'll contact the guys who PM'd me and we'll fix up NH.

I did think that Zed was talking about Digger.... my bad. Still not nice calling someone ghey.

eor

[Zedbra]

Originally posted by Jerry-Rig
I did think that Zed was talking about Digger.... my bad. Still not nice calling someone ghey.

eor

Wow. Looky what has gone on round 'ere. I can't even do ghey digs on Diggler the man loving trainer of the gheyest proportions without some gheyish comments about acting my age. Silly me.

Would it bother you if I told you I've gone deep into the bushes with Diggler? DEEP.

I would never say anything bad about Digger.

Putty, synchro, Diggler, and Dante are all mine, so ghey, so happy together.

:D I couldn't resist

[switch]

Originally posted by Zedbra
Would it bother you if I told you I've gone deep into the bushes with Diggler? DEEP.

It would bother me - I'd be very, very jealous! :mad:

[Jerry-Rig]

Originally posted by Zedbra
so ghey, so happy together.



Nice work !

[Redneck]

Deeds is speaking the truth , the bitter reality . Like it or not , we are now dealing with the DNV for the rest of time . If you want to continue riding , building , and maintaining trails , then taking the first step by fixing NH is important for the MtB communtiy . I don't think the DNV has a set list of trail building standards for bike trails, ssssooo that means we have to work at developing those standards with the DNV . I would regret having those people put together a list of standards without our input. We have to play along and fight for what we have and want to ride on. I've talked talked with the DNV man also , and he say's '' you need a letter of permision to do work''.

[LeeLau]

What a bureaucratic mess. bleh

[Sharon]

The area around mt hwy is a hot topic right now. Under the spot light, very political....

Lets hope the other areas stay under the radar.

If we can fix that trail up so the residents etc. can not complain about it that can't be a bad thing...

[Bryce]

rode NH yesterday, some recently completed sections

have things changed?

As much as I like drops and skinnies and all, we probably should keep the bottom of the mountain pretty basic. But props to whoever finished the bridges.

[TheGiggler]

reviving this old thread. :)

i was down Natrual High a couple months ago and it looked to be the same old?

Dirty Deeds, did anything come from talking to the district?

i would definitely be willing to help clean up the trail... i've got to agree that it's an eyesore and that 1st switchback down shouldn't really have any built-up stuff...

[dirty deeds]

Well, I went walked the trail with Richard Boase from the district a year ago and emailed him back and foth but never got the actual permission to work on it.

Shortly after someone (don't know who) went in there and did a bit of ladder bridge work. It's now broken, as is the bridge across the swamp so right now you can't even ride it without tromping through the swamp. This is the main thing that needs fixing. Other than that it's in pretty good shape.

[Bryce]

The little gap jump before the high ladder bridge is kinda screwed. We threw some cedar planks across the landing so that its still rideable

[Putty]

ok, just hold off on giving YOUR time back to the hobby until the powers that be decide how they want to use you.

what a joke.

the builders are providing a FREE service, but will not be allowed to express themselves creatively by building stunts.

at that point, why doesn't the district just get a bunch of inmates to bitch rocks around, its not a skill any fucktard can do that.

[KING-OF E-VILLE]

I have the permission fromthe district and am starting work on Saturday Feb 11 @9:30am

everyone is welcome to give me a hand.

thanks

[ratherberiding]

i stopped reading after people started bitching at each other so i don't know if things have changed from what was said in the begining of the thread about it being an xc trail with no stunts, but if they haven't how about making it just a fun little flowy trail, a couple berms some bits of technical? and maybe, eventually they will see that the building is done responsibly and well, and allow some moderate stunts.
i'm not 100% sure on this but i think the same kind of idea happened with some of the upper trails that were adopted.

just my 2 cents

,Earl

[Sketchy Flanders]

Nice thread to bring back. It shows the turmoil our group went thru over the last few years, and how things that we used to take for granted were suddenly being challenged. I will never take them for granted again. It also shows what is possible when different people choose to exercise their common interest.
See ya Saturday.

[Hack On Wheels]

Whats the plan for Natural High? There is a slim chance I'll be by to help, is the working going to a kind of regular thing or will the times change each week?

[KING-OF E-VILLE]

There is a current thread about the plans for NH,

I resurected this one just to get some attention, I'm hoping to get a good mini trail day happening on Saturday,

Mainly we are gonna re-build all of natural high from the top down, The DNV is on board, the only think is we are gonna lose the sky-bridge, but we'll do that last.

Saturday is gonna be a lot of Misc grooming, flow enhancement, berms, trannys and rock work, a bunch of us are gonna start building on the upper /first bridge section, but it all depends on how much material I can pull together.

Hope to see ya there.

Eric

[switch]

Hope to see ya there.

Eric:S

I thought you were Peter.

[KING-OF E-VILLE]

Switch, We've worked together a few times, Last time was on the expresso trail day with Synchro, We split the cedar together for the morning.

At least I thought that was you?

[switch]

Switch, We've worked together a few times, Last time was on the expresso trail day with Synchro, We split the cedar together for the morning.

At least I thought that was you?Nope - wasn't me.

I thought that KING-OF-E-VILLE was Peter Campbell. It's sometimes confusing - especially when people change their alias to some other obscure name. I think I'm going to change mine to my actual name.

[KING-OF E-VILLE]

Pete is "Dirty Deeds"

[ratherberiding]

king of e ville:
on the espresso trail day were you talking to me when i was pulling up all those old rotten cedar corderoid from the ground and you were telling me how you will probably pick up natrual high?

[switch]

Pete is "Dirty Deeds"Doh!!

[KING-OF E-VILLE]

king of e ville:
on the espresso trail day were you talking to me when i was pulling up all those old rotten cedar corderoid from the ground and you were telling me how you will probably pick up natrual high?

No, I think that was sysco

I was hulling cedar rounds out of the bush while you guys were tearing that up.