Olympic BMX

[Dantes Inferno]

Nuts.

Im wondering if half the possible potential medalists couldnt compete do to drug testing...

[Dean W]

France finished 1-2, with Anne-Caroline Chausson taking gold and Laetita le Corguille winning silver. American Jill Kintner won bronze.

[DaveM]

shitty about Graves crashing out in the mens. It looked like another rider crashed and his bike hit Graves' and pitched him over the bars.

[JCL]

Yep I felt so sorry for Graves. He was on for a medal IMO before he got hit.

[Dantes Inferno]

I would figure Canada would have had more than a few althetes also. Its too bad everyone can just live here or the states and then dominate for the other countries.

I also felt killer bad for graves, but there should be 3 runs total and select best 2 completed runs for the finals, if this was sprinting and a runnner took out another runner shit would hit the fan. The least we could do is give two chances.

[the_undertaker]

I would figure Canada would have had more than a few althetes also. Its too bad everyone can just live here or the states and then dominate for the other countries.

I also felt killer bad for graves, but there should be 3 runs total and select best 2 completed runs for the finals, if this was sprinting and a runnner took out another runner shit would hit the fan. The least we could do is give two chances.

contact is all part of racing. They actualy ran a really weird format there wich i guess they had for just the olympics. Imo canada didnt deserve more riders there. Sam Cools made it to the main by fluke becasue of all the girls that fell infront of her. Scott in the mens pretty much got squeezed out every round and pretty much shut down.

[jzogaris]

bummer for graves i was cheering for him to go all the way through, he must have a target on his back this year being taken out by other riders in both mtb world champs and olympic bmx, the south african rider who took graves out was leaning on a ridicoulus angle just inside graves and as he washed his bike clipped graves rear end, really sucks to train for four years to be taken out by someone elses mistake

[Dude]

Total points would have meant concervative racing. Going to the main final was the way to do it; we saw balls out racing by both men and women. No boatraces.

Not so much shocked as impressed by ACC. I figured Reed would be far and away faster than everyone, as she was in the Worlds, w/ ACC pulling in 2nd, but she raced like a vet, and had a great gate to allow her to control everything. Reed was reduced to the line she tried to take on the last corner, and most younger riders would have backed off and let her. ACC went right through her.

Fuck there is a love in for Graves here. It's truly embarrasing. The three best riders in the men's field placed that way.

Great for the sport, and what a great showcase.

[-Alex2-]

shitty about Graves crashing out in the mens. It looked like another rider crashed and his bike hit Graves' and pitched him over the bars.

Nhlapo of South Africa slid out in the second corner, hitting Graves' back wheel with his front. That was devastating, it looked like Graves might have even been in first for a split second there on the second straight, just before Nhlapo lost it! At the very least though, of the 3 guys who got taken out in the pileup, Graves was the only one who managed to get back up and walk the rest of the track. 6th out of 8, ahead of 2 DHFs, for the male gravity mountain biker in the Olympics.

[Dude]

Rose colored glasses.

Graves was never in control. He was one of the last out of the gate, and although he was able to make up a bit of ground in the 1st straight, he had no shot on the high/low in the first corner. He was stuck in no-mans land there.

Unfortunate he was taken out, but that's racing.

Please, stop with the love in just because he races a mountain bike.

[Tom]

Please, stop with the love in just because he races a mountain bike.

So...you're surprised that people on a mountain biking website wanted a mountain biker to win?

[Dude]

More surprised that apparently all you guys would like his name tattooed on your asses, and would father his children if possible.

To each their own.

[Lady Gravity]

More surprised that apparently all you guys would like his name tattooed on your asses, and would father his children if possible.

To each their own.

you eat breakfast at almost 11pm?

[jzogaris]

Graves was never in control. He was one of the last out of the gate, and although he was able to make up a bit of ground in the 1st straight, he had no shot on the high/low in the first corner. He was stuck in no-mans land there.

did you only watch the finals? because you cant say someone was never in control because they missed one gate. im pretty sure he won all his quarter final rounds by a long shot and looked to be in my opinion one of the fastest people on the track

[-Alex2-]

More surprised that apparently all you guys would like his name tattooed on your asses, and would father his children if possible.

...wow, what crawled up your ass? Tell us who you were rooting for so we can dump all over him.
Anyway, a bunch of Canadians on a mountain biking site rooting for an Australian for all the right reasons beats the hell out of rooting for someone because they live closest to you or within the same political borders as you (until one of you moves and your allegiances follow), or just rooting for whoever's most likely to win.
Also, Jared was one of the last riders to enter the first turn (diving to the inside and overtaking pretty much the entire field to emerge neck and neck for first on the second straight), and on the course there were 3 corners and 4 straights. You're saying he wouldn't have had a chance because he was on the outside of the second corner and would have been at the back of the pack on the third straight, and therefore one of the last riders to enter the last turn (diving to the inside and...)? Project past the data "Dude".

[the_undertaker]

Total points would have meant concervative racing. Going to the main final was the way to do it; we saw balls out racing by both men and women. No boatraces.

Not so much shocked as impressed by ACC. I figured Reed would be far and away faster than everyone, as she was in the Worlds, w/ ACC pulling in 2nd, but she raced like a vet, and had a great gate to allow her to control everything. Reed was reduced to the line she tried to take on the last corner, and most younger riders would have backed off and let her. ACC went right through her.

Fuck there is a love in for Graves here. It's truly embarrasing. The three best riders in the men's field placed that way.

Great for the sport, and what a great showcase.


reed had no chance in hell of passing there and was actualy dqed for that last corner move.

[Dude]

did you only watch the finals? because you cant say someone was never in control because they missed one gate. im pretty sure he won all his quarter final rounds by a long shot and looked to be in my opinion one of the fastest people on the track


Yeah, I watched.

As stated he entered the corner next to last. He was positioned in the middle, while stronger riders were on the high side. It may have appeared he was overtaking others, but the fact is that he was in no-man's land, because the other guys had the better lines. High / low. Jared way stuck in the middle w/ less momentum on his side, while Mike Day, Donny Robinson, and particularily Strombergs had the high positions, and shot down to take the fastest line.

Graves wasn't even close. All he could do was keep in touch, and hope for a mistake or crash in front of him. Again, too bad about the mistake next to him.

That track is all about getting position out of the gate, then having the balls to hold it through turn #1. Strombergs owned it at the worlds, and the Olympics. 1st out both times.

As for Reed, yeah, she was DQ'd because it was deemed she made contact from behind. You can defend you line, and if you have even 1", you can take it agressively. But, she was behind and in the low spot on the corner, and tried to block ACC w/ the T-Bone maneuver, and force her to her brakes. ACC just wasn't having any of that and held her line, and carried her momentum (again, high / low). Had she laid off, and no contact was made, Reed would have slowed ACC enough to have a shot at gold, and not been DQ'd. She did all she could to win gold, and nothing but.

Dirty move, but again, that's racing.

And, no bug crawled up my ass, I just find it funny, and kind of embarassing for a bunch of grown men to be so gaga over an Aussie kid riding a bicycle.

[sheffy]

[QUOTE=Dude;2008530]Yeah, I watched.



Graves wasn't even close. All he could do was keep in touch, and hope for a mistake or crash in front of him. Again, too bad about the mistake next to him.


QUOTE]

Are you sure you were watching the same race...how can you say he wasnt even close???? Graves made an incredible pass outta turn one and was right with the pack..

[Dude]

There is a reason why the bottom part of that turn is always empty. No momentum coming out.

Yes, he made a pass, but he had NO HOPE on the top three who were ahead and high, with momentum and speed pushing them from the high side down into the second straight.

Again, look at the women's race. Reed appeared to come out of nowhere when she went low, and tried to cut off ACC. ACC had the high side, and went low with way more speed and momentum, and did not back off on Reed's T-Bone attempt. Reed got the worst of it, and a DQ for good measure.

Graves wasn't even in position to try a move like Reeds. All he could do at that point was try and keep the top 3 in touch, and hope for an error. Strombergs is technically untouchable, and has the gates, speed, and lines all dialled.

Sorry Graves booster club...he had no chance, even when moving up from 7/8th out of the gate for a brief moment to 4th. He had a bad line.

[Col. Sanders]

Who cares where a riders roots are. Alot of the elite riders switch disciplines and excel at what ever bike they ride. There are riders that go from BMX to velo, mtn bike to BMX etc.

Graves is fast, so is ACC. Both of them have been riding BMX for the past 4 years when they realized there was an opportunity for them to go to the olympics.

I think ACC and Graves actaully have an advantage on a supercross track design they ride in the olympics because the riders are going faster and the jumps are bigger in the first straight. Coming from a mountain bike background they would be more accustomed to this type of riding.


on a standard BMX track graves would be lucky to make the semi's. the depth of skill on the smaller tracks in unreal. If the olympics track design was like any normal world class BMX track, Kyle Bennett runs away with the gold.

[Dude]

ACC actually grew up racing BMX before moving to mountain. Just came back for Olympic glory. Same with Jill Kitner.

Not sure on Grave's background, but seeing that nearly all top DH / DS / 4X pros come from a BMX background, wouldn't be surprised if he did too.

On jumping and speed- on the whole, BMXers are better jumpers. I have a tough time manning up on a BMX track and jumping a table that I wouldn't think twice about on my MTB. Shocks fix mistakes. I see 10-12 year old kids airing out tables most my mountain bike buddies would never attempt. Same w/ speed. Need any proof, go to a track and watch on the days they have mountain bike class. The MTBs are freaking slow, slow, slow compared to the little bikes. It's because of the weight difference, and sprinting. BMXers know speed.

And, it shows in that race. The guys who train for the sport, and dedicate for the sport excelled. Graves did very well to make the main, but he wasn't and isn't the best BMXer in that field.

[-Alex2-]

Not sure on Grave's background, but seeing that nearly all top DH / DS / 4X pros come from a BMX background, wouldn't be surprised if he did too.

"First of all [BMX] was just, sort of, cross training; you know, something to do in the off season that wasn't racing mountain bikes, but was still racing bikes." -Jared Graves

Realize that not only is it possible for a top BMXer to cross over to 4x and do well (as long as they can handle loose corners without the front end pushing; mountain bikers don't pave their courses), but vice versa as well. You say BMX and 4x like NHL and WHL, but there have been lots of seccessful transitions both ways, and lots of failed transitions both ways (though I might add that it's far more common for a mountain biker to temporarily switch, without the intention of staying converted no matter how well they do, whereas converted BMXers are far more likely to actually prefer mountain biking and stick with it).

For the last time, yes Graves doesn't have the gate of most of the other guys in the final, but in the first corner he went high/low and ended up neck and neck for first, with a little bit of a gap in the field back to third. In the second corner of course he was forced to go high, because he was fighting for first, not in control of it, and couldn't just choose whatever line he wanted. So it was outside all the way in the second corner. This would have left him about where he was on the first straight for the third. Therefore, the obvious choice would be to go high/low in the last corner and try to repeat what he did in the first, as the front guys at that point would be duking it out amongst each other on the high line trying to get as much momentum as possible for the last straight. No I'm not saying he was guaranteed a win, in fact it's very unlikely that that would have happenned the way things were. However, it's just as unlikely that he'd end up in contention for first after the way his first straight went, but he did it.

You don't sound very good on any kind of bike on a BMX track "Dude". I guess you're more of a backseat driver, hey? Which would explain your posts on here every five minutes.

And mountain bikes don't have "shocks". There may or may not be a shock in the rear, but if there's any suspension up front then it is manifested as a suspension FORK.

Smarten the fuck up!

[Dean W]

Wow Dude, I can understand that your kid races BMX now and you may have some extra insight, but you really are crapping on people for wanting a Mtn. Biker to do well in the Olympics.

Sure he was in the middle of the turn when he was taken out, but he was still in a position to podium. EVERYONE had a chance to finish the race and he actually had a chance to get top 3 until he was taken out. Unfortunate, but in BMX, rubbin is racing.

We can all analyze the footage all we want and hypothetically say this or that, but he was in the race with a very good chance to get a medal.

The best racer on the day won, it was an exciting race, but 'we'.....the fans that want to have ' his name tattooed on [our] asses, and would father his children if possible' would have really liked to seen him finish the final without being taken out. 'We' feel he might have been on the podium.

Now for the women's race......I was stoked to see ACC get gold.....I am British born, but I like ACC as racer and seeing her win Olympic gold was wicked.

[Dude]

Alex,

I am terribly sorry to hurt your feelings so badly, I had no idea.

Listen, at no point did I say Graves sucked. Clearly he doesn't, but you and everyone else is wearing rose colored glasses if you think he was in position to win. He was in position to hope for someone to fuck up or crash, that's about it.

The best racer in the world for that sport won, full stop. Strombergs has proven untouchable on that track. Again guys, sorry, but Graves diving down was a desperate move because he knew he had no line. He was not high, he was middle low entering.

Alex, lighten the fuck up. One thing I wouldn't do is get personal about bikes and skills until you've had a chance to ride with me. I can handle myself pretty damn well on the mountain, thanks. On the BMX track, I handle myself fine, but will also tell you I've been humbled by some very good riders who have never seen a mountain bike, but have spent their lives at the track.

[-Alex2-]

I don't know, I guess some people just get their jollies by arguing. I really hate arguing. I will only ever get into an argument if I happen to believe what I'm saying is right, and nobody else is hitting the nail on the head. I've met a lot of people who will argue to the death over something they're not sure about, very often even when everybody knows it, but I pride myself on always trying to have the most objective point of view. I don't take arguing very lightly ("Alex, lighten the fuck up"). So if you didn't understand why I got/get pissed off after a few rallies of an argument, hopefully now you do. By definition I never argue, I STATE the most objective point of view, and I hope you can see past how narcisistic that sounds and recognize the difference.
I know that it's impossible to objectively root for someone in a race, that's not what I'm saying. As I said before, I think we're all rooting for Graves for good reasons, as far as picking favourites goes. And you're really pissing me off by continuing to say that we/I thought he was going to win! In fact, my exact words were "I'm not saying he was guaranteed a win, in fact it's very unlikely that that would have happenned the way things were." (Although one little mistake from whoever was on his right on the second straight and he would have in fact been the most likely to win, as he would have a lead, and choice of lines for the rest of the track.) Nevertheless, you're not going to convert me, so stop trying!
I am also aware that I did get "personal about bikes and skills" with you, and again, that wasn't very objective of me. I suppose I appologise for that. That was just because you were pissing me off.
My bottom line all along has been why don't you just speak well of Strombergs instead of putting down Jared amid a crowd of his supporters? If you insist that that would mean getting his name tattooed on your ass, then by all means, whatever floats your boat. But the truth is, there's nothing wrong with Jared, and in fact there's a whole lot right about him, so if you prefer Strombergs, start from there.
And I think I'll pass on that chance to ride with you. I don't care how good you are.

[Golden Boy]

The course was so sick - as soon as I saw it I said 'oh my god I wish me and a bunch of buddies could spend one day on that course.' Imagine the opportunity to session that track for a day, or a few days?! F me would that ever be fun. Really exciting event to watch, really glad I got to see it....had given up on watching the ho-lympics after day in and day out of gymnastics and swimming.....weak.

nate

[Dude]

I don't know, I guess some people just get their jollies by arguing. I really hate arguing.

I guess we differ there. I enjoy a good debate. I also enjoy taking the piss a bit, thus the booster club comments.

Which still stand and I don't appologise for.


As I said before, I think we're all rooting for Graves for good reasons, as far as picking favourites goes. And you're really pissing me off by continuing to say that we/I thought he was going to win! In fact, my exact words were "I'm not saying he was guaranteed a win, in fact it's very unlikely that that would have happenned the way things were." (Although one little mistake from whoever was on his right on the second straight and he would have in fact been the most likely to win, as he would have a lead, and choice of lines for the rest of the track.) Nevertheless, you're not going to convert me, so stop trying!


Well, I'll give it one last chance, just for shits and giggles.

As the, erm...thedude:rolleyes: pointed out, I am coming at this from a bit of an enlightened situation. Long story short, I got my kid into BMX racing a couple of years back w/ the goal of getting him on a DH bike in a few years. Everyone knows the BMX track is the best place to get kids serious about riding bikes at a young age. Well, within two of his races I started racing as well. You get to know the sport awfully quick, and what I can tell you is that it is simply humbling when you see the level of skills in some of these young kids. I mean, eye popping stuff that you simply don't see out of the vast majority of the mtb crowd. I've raced, at one point or another over the past 20 years, a bit of everything...DH, XC, Road, Time Trail. I am moderately good at all, and not great in any. That said, nothing is as humbling as the track.

One of the things you quickly learn is the importance of gates. If your gates suck, your chances suck pretty badly. It is so hard to move through the field. In a 30-40 second race, you may be able to make one or two passes, and that is if you are good.

"I'm not saying he was guaranteed a win, in fact it's very unlikely that that would have happenned the way things were."

Point taken, BUT, you and many others stated you / they thought he was in position to win or podium. I've been arguing he wasn't.

Graves was 7th out of the gate. I'm not being condescending, but at that point his race was effectively over- unless he could keep in touch, hope for a mistake or crash. Strombergs is not only the best out of the gate, but technically flawless. He races mistake free and fast from the front. He did it at Worlds, and did it at Olympics. Once he's out front, the rest of the field is praying for an unlikely fuck up from him.

That's my last 2 bits on this. Take it for what it is, but purely objective.


I am also aware that I did get "personal about bikes and skills" with you, and again, that wasn't very objective of me.

My bottom line all along has been why don't you just speak well of Strombergs instead of putting down Jared amid a crowd of his supporters? If you insist that that would mean getting his name tattooed on your ass, then by all means, whatever floats your boat. But the truth is, there's nothing wrong with Jared, and in fact there's a whole lot right about him, so if you prefer Strombergs, start from there.
And I think I'll pass on that chance to ride with you. I don't care how good you are

Didn't say there was anything wrong with the guy. In fact, I think I stated it was amazing riding that got him to the main. Every one of those guys are great riders, and any one would slay on either a mountain, or track. What I am saying was, objectively, he wasn't close. I am also pointing out that the lot of you want to believe something that simply wasn't going to happen. That is opinion, though, and you back up your opinions through argument- as I have.

I suppose I appologise for that. That was just because you were pissing me off.


You don't have to apologize for it. But I will point out you questioned my abilities on a bike based on my use of an old school term. Pretty lame.

Back when mountain bikes first started appearing w/ "front suspension" in the late '80s / early '90s (can't remember, but the first bike I ever sold w/ any suspension was a Cannondale- rigid front, hard tail rear, then along came Rock Shox for aftermarket sales, and Marzocchi), we called them shocks. Because, you know, that's what they were. Rock Shox are called "Rock Shox" for obvious reasons.

You don't have to apologize, just come riding, and decide if I'm really a back seat driver. I may not be better than you, and frankly, I'm just fine w/ that. You may be the best DHer in the Lower Mainland- but I guarantee I can hang with you, whoever you happen to be. Invite is open.

[-Alex2-]

Very diplomatic. To be fair it should be said that BMX is magnitudes more accessible for very young kids than DH. If it were safe/responsible for a parent to put a 5 year old on MSA I'm sure you'd see the same sort of "eye popping stuff" of those same kids at 12 that you do on the BMX track.
I'm tired of making my argument for Graves, 'fraid you'll have to scroll for that one again. But it'll always be the same argument, so with the help of the Ctrl + C function on your keyboard there's no reason you couldn't keep "debating" long after I'm gone. Should still scratch your itch.
I can't help but see that Telus ad about the fish's hairdo running through my head, with the high pitched music: "It was acceptable in the '80s..."
As for your invite, shall we say trials then?

[Dude]

Bastage...you picked something I've never done. :D

Tricycles in the parking lot. But not tomorrow, or the next day...spending the week in Tofino, and the waves are calling.

[the_undertaker]

I have no clue what your talking about. All this mtb malarkey aside, what graves did was pretty incredible. The consistency he showed all through has qualifyers was unreal and in bmx consistency is a HUGE thing. I dont remember but didnt he win all his qualifyers? Ya he got a shotty gate in the main but he pulled a huge high low move in the first corner wich is super hard since alot of people were sliding out through there at full track speed hitting it normaly. He played the 2nd corner safe and i wouldnt have been suprised to see him pass a couple people down the 3rd straight and in the last corner since he had the skill to do so. Its just too bad he got taken out there. Alot can happen with half the race to go.